Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: But when I came to understand this, truly, by revelation from God that I am a new creation, that I can live from my new identity, I mean, that frees me up from trying to live this life that I can't live anyways. And it goes back to that. From not for mentality.
[00:00:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:00:18] Speaker A: I was living for God and it was like, pat on the back, good for you, Zach. Like, you know, God is lucky to have you.
Like, oh, man, what a silly, silly way to live.
[00:00:29] Speaker B: Right?
[00:00:29] Speaker A: Because I can never.
I'm never going to match up to what the law would expect of me or what any. Any person, including myself, that makes up laws that.
[00:00:40] Speaker B: Right.
[00:00:41] Speaker A: That I think I need to do in order to please God. When I realized that, man, I'm a new creation and I can trust God and my trusting him actually pleases him the most.
[00:00:50] Speaker B: Right.
[00:00:50] Speaker A: It's like when, wow, that's a lot easier way to live. Hello and welcome. It's Carl and Zach here. Let's Talk Life. Our little podcast, Talking Life in Christ. The last couple weeks, we've been discussing Galatians 2:20 and that verse specifically being our identity statement. And now, you know, we want to dig into testimonies of how I have been crucified with Christ. Galatians 2:20 has affected people's lives and their ministries, and so. So here we are. Why not start with us? Yes, it's a good place to begin.
So we have a couple of friends that might jump on also.
But for now, I have some questions for us. Carl.
[00:01:34] Speaker B: All right.
[00:01:35] Speaker A: How you doing, Kyle? You're coming off a big trip up to Michigan, which is where I'm originally from. It's where both our parents live now and most of our family.
[00:01:43] Speaker B: So, yeah, saw your family.
[00:01:46] Speaker A: Yeah, awesome.
[00:01:47] Speaker B: Had a great reunion with my family and, you know, last two weeks of just surrender of, you know, I mean, I just think back to, like, how God is. So we use the word good and he is, but. But just. He's just so amazing. Like, he just like the realm, his realm that he brings us up, right. He calls us up into, you know, so we can see things. His eyes. He opens our eyes that.
That my youngest, two weeks ago, is standing on first base. And if he scores, they're going to Mississippi for the World Series, and.
But they don't score, and then they lose and then lose the next game, and it's over. And because of that, it gave us opportunity for Sam and I to go up to Michigan to be with my family. And so I'm always thinking of, like, God, I want to see things your way. Like, I just. Like. Like when. When He. He has these divine encounters where it's like, God, only you could have done this. Like, you prepared this. And so just being open, holding planes loosely for what he has for you, me listener, is such a freeing way. It's such a beautiful way, because God will surprise us. There's a playfulness of God where it's. It's only He. He's the only one that could have done it, you know?
[00:03:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:01] Speaker B: And so when you think about, you know, my life over the last couple weeks, it's like, all right, God, I just.
Just available. I'm willing and available.
[00:03:09] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah.
So you're talking. You're saying that even though you're living the Christ life, Christ in you, things don't always go smoothly.
[00:03:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
Right. And people like me, who like to plan everything out.
[00:03:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:24] Speaker B: We gotta. You gotta.
[00:03:26] Speaker A: Sure.
[00:03:26] Speaker B: Write it in pencil.
[00:03:27] Speaker A: Yeah, that's. Yeah, for sure. That's one. You know, I was just pondering these questions, and I know somewhere in there I wrote something along the lines of. Well, I'm still learning. I'm still learning this.
[00:03:39] Speaker B: Right.
[00:03:40] Speaker A: Because it is. It's easy to slip back into old thinking. Old behavior can come right along with that if you continue in that old thinking.
[00:03:47] Speaker B: Right.
[00:03:48] Speaker A: And it's. It's a lot of times really easy just to jump in and try to get your hands around something. Because you think that if I can control this, if I can make the outcome be what I think it should be, then. Then we'll be all right. But like we said, you know, we're talking off camera.
That control is oftentimes. Well, it always is an illusion because we're not. We're not in control. So I love that. I love that way of speaking, like you said, holding your plans loosely.
I'm. I'm not good either at things being shaken up. Like, if I'm in a day where I just know that it's whatever, that's fine. But when I have a plan, when I know that something is or I need to be somewhere, it's like, you know, am I willing to just stop if something needs to be stopped? For am I. Am I willing to take that call if somebody's calling? And it's like, there are times that I'm still like, okay, but I gotta be somewhere. So I can't take this call right now. But it's like, well, is this what I'm supposed to be doing? God, like, yeah. So it's. It's It's a journey. It's a journey of trusting and. And walking, for sure, by faith.
[00:04:49] Speaker B: So, yeah, we.
[00:04:51] Speaker A: We have, like, 15 questions. We're certainly not going to answer all of them, but just there to create conversation.
[00:04:57] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I know you've looked at these first, so is there. Is there something that you want to answer first?
[00:05:03] Speaker A: And, I mean, I think. I think it's maybe wise, even just. I thought maybe the first question just leaves us, like, talking about stuff that we've already in our stories. But there's nothing wrong with, like, sharing a little bit of our story. Maybe a shortened version. The question is this. When did Galatians 2:20. I have been crucified with Christ become first, Become more than just averse to you and actually start functioning as your identity statement? And I just look back, you know, I was a leader in a church. I was. There was a stirring, there was an uneasiness, an unhappiness because I started praying this prayer out of Ephesians 1 and 3, and it led me to resign. Eventually. It led me to moving away. But after resignation, I kind of was just floundering for a few months. Like, I'm at peace with where I'm at, but I also don't know what I'm doing next. And. And that's where an email from you, Carl, said, hey, go to John Lynch Conference. I was like, okay, who's this guy? And that led me to reading the Cure. And that led me to class. And class is really probably the first time that I really heard Galatians 2:20 taught. Yeah, it was in the Cure, but I just like to identify it. And actually, let's talk about each statement in this verse. And it was like, whoa, this is for me.
This is me. This is who I am in Christ. I have been crucified. It wasn't just Paul saying that. And it just. That's where it really shifted everything for me and took me from, you know. Yeah. A salary and being in a position to where I could continue there for probably a very long time. And. But it led me to resignation. And that's just so backward when I think about it.
[00:06:43] Speaker B: Right.
[00:06:43] Speaker A: None. None of it made sense, but that was the first time that it really became real to me.
It took resigning for it to become real to me. And God knew that that's what it took. And so that's exactly my journey there.
[00:06:55] Speaker B: So it was like. It was probably like a process then.
[00:06:58] Speaker A: Absolutely.
[00:06:59] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:00] Speaker A: For sure. Because I. So I say this all the time. If I didn't Resign from church work as a youth and assistant pastor. I never would have gone to a John lynch conference because I didn't need to hear from John Lynch. I didn't need to read the Cure because I was already teaching the gospel.
[00:07:15] Speaker B: Right. Right.
[00:07:17] Speaker A: As much as I knew of it, I didn't realize what I was missing.
And so, yeah, I wouldn't have seen it.
[00:07:24] Speaker B: One of the things that rest of the gospel puts it so well, so this is where I'm getting it from, is that you and I, we knew how to take. Tell someone to. How to. How to get to heaven or how to be forgiven.
[00:07:34] Speaker A: Right.
[00:07:35] Speaker B: You know, but. But to the Galatians 2:20, the life. The life of Christ, that was foreign. Right?
[00:07:42] Speaker A: I mean, just totally.
[00:07:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Like a deer in headlights. Like, I have no idea what you're talking about.
[00:07:47] Speaker A: Yeah. And they're. They're sat in the Bible all along.
[00:07:50] Speaker B: So this is. And I don't think we're alone. So it's, hey, trust Jesus and be miserable like me.
[00:07:58] Speaker A: Right?
[00:07:58] Speaker B: Trust. Trust Jesus and go to church and we will put down a bunch of law and tell you how to live by, you know, coming three times a week and start helping with the kids, because we need a lot of help with the kids. And. Yeah, like, just, just like, wait a
[00:08:13] Speaker A: minute, there's no life.
[00:08:14] Speaker B: And that was. That was a question that you had been, you know, percolating in your mind for some. Some years. I know. There were times for me too, just thinking, is this all there is?
[00:08:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:08:25] Speaker B: You know, this machine of the church life where.
Where all we're doing is leading to Sunday morning, and it's like, yeah.
[00:08:32] Speaker A: Just.
[00:08:32] Speaker B: Yeah. There was something. There was something off that our new hearts were crying for.
[00:08:36] Speaker A: Yeah. Yep.
[00:08:37] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:38] Speaker A: Wow. It just. It just takes me back to a guy that I met here since I've been in Florida, and he was. I remember going to his house and just. Just meeting with them, talking further about all of this stuff. And he literally was at a place, like, he understood a lot of this stuff, but he really didn't know how to apply it to his own life. And one of the statements that he made, he was looking at his life and he decided, it just can't. It can't end this way. It can't end this way. He just kept saying that.
[00:09:05] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:09:05] Speaker A: And I just looked in, Looked at him and said, it doesn't.
[00:09:08] Speaker B: Right.
[00:09:09] Speaker A: You're just not seeing who you are.
[00:09:12] Speaker B: Right.
[00:09:13] Speaker A: And you're not resting in that. In that truth. And the sad reality is that he. Since Passed away because he had some real serious heart issues that came up in. In the last year, and it just. Eventually he didn't wake up one morning.
And so the rest there is that. Well, he knows now.
He knows now.
[00:09:33] Speaker B: The.
[00:09:34] Speaker A: The victory that he has now is the victory that he had when he was here. He just couldn't see it.
[00:09:39] Speaker B: Yeah. Wow. And it's well said.
[00:09:42] Speaker A: Obviously. Obviously, when you. When you're in heaven, you can. You can see it much clearer because you have no flesh in the way. But.
But we can see and taste heaven right here.
[00:09:52] Speaker B: Yeah, that's.
[00:09:53] Speaker A: That's. That's it.
[00:09:54] Speaker B: And that's the invitation the Father has for all of us. Right? Come and see. Taste and see.
[00:09:58] Speaker A: Yeah. Right.
[00:10:00] Speaker B: All throughout Scripture. Come and see.
[00:10:01] Speaker A: Right?
[00:10:02] Speaker B: Come and see.
[00:10:03] Speaker A: So good. So. Well, we got one question done, Carl. I don't even know if we got done. Do you want to answer it?
[00:10:08] Speaker B: Yeah. We have none. Yeah. I would say reading the Cure. So reading the cure in 2019, towards the end, because it was a book I. I didn't have time for. And, you know, I think. I think I read Wild the Heart first. I read Wild the Heart in, like, August, and I must have read the Cure at some point in the fall, and so didn't really connect Galatians 2:20 fully. Like, I didn't really understand that until probably even January 2021, when I got connected with some exchange life teachers and in the Virginia area, and I started to understand these things and don't quite remember for a certain book or just people that were teaching this. So I would say, like, 21. So now. So there's, like, some lines of growth, so lack of better language that I can just say, man, I remember, like, wild at heart. I remember the Cure. And so then I remember the Exchange life and just thinking kind of like you at first, you're kind of, like, angry of, yeah, yeah. Why isn't this being taught? And it was also kind of like, was this taught? And I missed it because. So preoccupied with women, so preoccupied with opposite sex. You know, going through Bible college and going through, you know, your early 20s, you're all you're concerned about is woman, woman, woman. Did I miss this all? Like, did I miss it? And it was like, actually, I didn't miss it because we've all missed it. And so understanding, like, you know, Galatians 2:20. You know, it was just. It was. It was very unthinkable word. We've used a lot. It was very freeing. It is no longer I who live yeah, but it's Christ who lives in me.
[00:11:42] Speaker A: Yes. Wow. Yeah. So good. It's so good. I. I wanted to jump just because you mentioned that. And I'm trying to find it because there is a question here somewhere about freedom. How has it freed you up?
[00:11:54] Speaker B: Yeah, that's a great question. In what ways has embracing this identity freed you from performance, People pleasing or trying to earn God's approval? Like, how. How would you answer. How would you go first? How would you answer that, man?
[00:12:06] Speaker A: I mean, how I would answer that man? Like, it's. It's so relaxing to now just live my life as me. Like, so, going back to the Cure the subtitle, I. I don't know if I have it in my head. Right. But what if God isn't who you think he is and neither are you? That that statement probably would have been the reason why I wouldn't have never read that book.
[00:12:29] Speaker B: That's right.
[00:12:30] Speaker A: And me too, because it's like, no, I know God.
I know who. I don't need this.
[00:12:37] Speaker B: Nope.
[00:12:38] Speaker A: But I didn't know.
I had a misconception about even who God was.
I knew that he loved me, but I also felt that there was judgment from him because I wasn't shaping up the way that I should. And I had these things in my life that I couldn't overcome. And I thought all the bad things in life were punishment from him and I couldn't see myself Right. But when I. When I came to understand this by truly just by revelation from God, to understand that I am a new creation, that I can live from my new identity, I mean, that changes, and that frees me up from trying to live this life that I can't live anyways. And it goes back to that. From not for mentality.
[00:13:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:13:21] Speaker A: I was living for God and it was like, pat on the back, good for you, Zach. Like, you know, God is lucky to have you.
Like, oh, man, what a silly, silly way to live.
[00:13:32] Speaker B: Right?
[00:13:32] Speaker A: Because I can never.
I'm never going to match up to what the law would expect of me or what any. Any person, including myself, that makes up laws that.
[00:13:43] Speaker B: Right.
[00:13:44] Speaker A: That I think I need to do in order to please God. When I realized that, man, I'm a new creation and I can trust God and my trusting him actually pleases him the most.
It's like when, wow, that's a lot easier way to live. And you know what else came of it? All the addictive things, all the. All the shame, all the misunderstandings and the degrading of myself. All of that has become less because I'm not trying to fight those things anymore. They're already dead. And I'm trusting the reality that I'm a new creation, that the old man is dead and I'm new.
And so I can stand on these truths and on these promises. So it's very, very beautiful. What about you?
[00:14:23] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:14:24] Speaker A: Freed up. How so?
[00:14:26] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely. It definitely was very significant that it is Christ in me. And. And part of this journey. I would say, like, I would use the word process too. You know, for me, seven years. That how the Father sees me is my true self. That's who I am.
[00:14:42] Speaker A: Amen.
[00:14:43] Speaker B: My identity is in Christ, in me. It's not defined by my worst failure. It's not defined by my sin.
[00:14:49] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:14:50] Speaker B: Is defined by my Father in heaven, who loved me and gave his Son for me. And so understanding that. And then it became like, oh, I look back and I'm not. I'm not bashful about this at all. I'll say it to anybody. I believe systematic theology and dispensational theology affected me where I thought I had God figured out. So God actually became very small to me. And I've never seen God as big as he is now. I've never. I've never had a bigger view of God. And, you know, and. And I've. You know, there's some pushback of so much grace, so much gr. And you're trivializing God or you're trivializing sin. I've never had a bigger view of God.
[00:15:28] Speaker A: Right.
[00:15:28] Speaker B: Than I do. Bigger than me. Go ahead.
[00:15:32] Speaker A: And. And I've never been as free from the mental battle of sin.
[00:15:38] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:15:39] Speaker A: Than when I started to see this and understand who I am.
[00:15:43] Speaker B: Right.
[00:15:43] Speaker A: So sorry to interrupt.
[00:15:44] Speaker B: No, that's good. So. So he who is in me is greater than he who's in the world. And so when. When the. The attacks of the enemy come through people.
[00:15:55] Speaker A: Right.
[00:15:56] Speaker B: God, you're bigger than them. I don't have to justify myself. I don't defend myself. I can entrust myself to you. Right. Entrusting myself to you. And so it starts with, you know, Galatians 2:20.
[00:16:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:16:08] Speaker B: Freeing. Very freeing.
[00:16:09] Speaker A: Yeah. So good. And so I. I think for the few minutes we have left, it'd be awesome to step into the next.
[00:16:16] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:16:16] Speaker A: Section because it's about. That was about life. Just how it's affected our life. And now it's. How does it affected our ministry? Yeah. And I don't even know what question specifically.
[00:16:25] Speaker B: Yeah.
Maybe even for you, like that second question. Or the third question, how has it changed?
Instead of ministry, how about just ministering or serving? How. How has that verse changed you and how you serve and how you minister to others? Teach. Teach others.
[00:16:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
And this is. This is where I. This is where I put. Like, while I'm still learning.
[00:16:48] Speaker B: That's. That's a great answer.
That's a great answer.
[00:16:52] Speaker A: Like, I've. I've really gleaned a lot. I'm hoping that Scott can jump on and share a little bit.
Our friend Scott, his coaching questions and the stuff that you and he put together, like the coaching questions, I'm still learning how to use that. And, like the feelings wheel.
[00:17:07] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:17:07] Speaker A: And. But. But I love.
I love what they do for me in working with people, because it's less about me giving someone an answer and more about me just asking the right questions for them to really just ponder and trust some truths from God and some words and wisdom from God and maybe some revelation from God. And it's not about me trying to fix them, but I think I put a note. Let's see if I can find it. I'm still learning. I put that down. I'm still learning not to be a fixer. And I wrote this even down. That's because I. I edit these videos, you know, our podcasts, and I oftentimes see that my section of audio is always bigger than yours. And I'm like, dang it, why do I always have to say so much? Because I feel like I have to fill the space or I feel, you know, I have to say something. And that's where I'm still learning. Like, especially working with somebody, like, tell me. Just. Just sit and to listen more than to speak or to give answers or to give advice, and just learning to ask those questions. So I don't know if I'm even answering the question right, but.
[00:18:16] Speaker B: Well, first of all, your name's on here. First and second of all, like, I. I look at you as the host, and I'm just here to help. Yeah. Not as a stage. Right. Just help each other, you know, And I think that's, like, going on with that question. Like, we don't have to fix people. We don't have to. We don't have to give them the right answer.
I was sharing with a guy we met in Florida, Mike, with Wayne Jacobson Group, and.
[00:18:40] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
[00:18:41] Speaker B: And I was telling him of Wayne's wisdom, of when you came to him with a question, and he just said, hey, bring to the Father, you know, and. And it's like, man, what pastor doesn't want to give advice so you come back to him or.
[00:18:54] Speaker A: Right.
[00:18:55] Speaker B: What pastor doesn't want to give advice so you keep coming to the church or keep coming to this instead of saying, hey, I want to equip you to trust God. I want to equip you to listen to the Father. I want to. I want to equip you to how. How you can voice like that. That's. That's a different way to live, isn't it?
[00:19:12] Speaker A: It is, yep. Yeah. Well, it's. What's difficult is that coming off of many, many years. And it's interesting because my personality isn't to. To talk and to fix and to be the. The bold, like, natural leader, but because you're in a position that you have to give an answer because people are asking questions.
[00:19:31] Speaker B: Yeah, you.
[00:19:33] Speaker A: It's. And unfortunately, yes, our question often, or our answer to their question often is, well, you know, you just need to really plug in every single week and be here. You know, if you can commit to this time every Sunday and then come midweek and be a part of the. It's like that's really what's going to help you. And it's like there's some truth to that because having a good community of people that are. That you're with consistently is going to encourage you. So it's not like it was wrong.
[00:19:58] Speaker B: Right.
[00:19:59] Speaker A: But like many things that are there, we're not wrong. And we're not. We're not fighting against people saying, you're wrong, you're wrong, you're wrong. What we're really saying and what we're saying about ourselves even in the past, is that what we were teaching was just incomplete and we weren't really offering them true freedom into live as a free child of God that you are. Know that you are a new creation. Trust this reality.
[00:20:25] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:20:26] Speaker A: And so we're not equipping and sending very well. We're instead trying to just hoard people and bring them in and say, we can help you. If you just stay plugged in, it'll help. And that's all the advice we could give.
[00:20:37] Speaker B: Hey, so I want you to answer this last question. I know we're short on time, but if someone's listening today and they're burnt out, they're struggling.
[00:20:48] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:20:48] Speaker B: How would you encourage them in terms of Galatians 2, 20? And what would you say to that person who's feeling, you know, burnt out and. Right. Sure. Exhausted.
This is emotional, spiritual. Yeah.
[00:21:01] Speaker A: I love, I love how God just Confirms. And this has been my rest with people all the time. And my. My consistent go to thing for people is ask God. So you, you already brought it up the way that Wayne Jac kind of, hey, let's bring that to the Father. And in specific, like, if somebody wants something specific, like what do I ask the Father?
I take right to what really impacted me. Because it's not some prayer that Joe Blow wrote. It's actually straight from the scripture, Right. And I just say, well, first of all, read Ephesians chapter one and list and underline or highlight all the things that say that you are, and then start to ponder those things and start to trust those realities. And if you can't see eye to eye with those, then you need to talk to God about that because he's saying that's who you are. And then the prayer, the prayer there at the end of chapter one and at the end of chapter three that Paul is praying for the church. I actually have a personalized prayer that I physically print out and give to people and say, pray this prayer, Ephesians 1. And I have it already personalized. So instead of saying I'm praying for the church, it's. I'm praying God for me, for my life, for my ministry. I pray it now over other people and I put their name in it instead.
And it's.
[00:22:16] Speaker B: It.
[00:22:16] Speaker A: That's what really catapulted me. So if I just narrow it down to Ephesians 1:17, as I often times do, just for the sake of getting the point across, right, it says, God, would you give them a spirit of wisdom and revelation to know you? That's a different type of prayer than I've ever prayed before. It was always, God, expand my territory. You know, bless the things that I'm doing.
And instead, this prayer was not about anything that I'm doing. It's about me knowing him.
So my first, my first step and my first advice is always ask God. Yeah, ask God for wisdom.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: So good.
[00:22:53] Speaker A: That's so. Yeah. That's the life, man.
[00:22:55] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:22:57] Speaker A: Yeah, thank you, Carl. It's always a joy doing this together. And we're out of time today. Until next time. Over and out.
I don't even know if I can hit stop.
I can't get to my stop button.
[00:23:12] Speaker B: Where is it?
[00:23:14] Speaker A: There it is.
