Ep. 65 - Clarity

[00:00:00] Speaker A: In my notes here, growth is mind renewal, not heart repair. [00:00:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:00:05] Speaker A: It goes along with what you're saying. [00:00:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:00:08] Speaker A: Growth, not necessarily a word that I love or use all the time, but I would say maturity. [00:00:14] Speaker B: Maturity, yes, yes. [00:00:16] Speaker A: Is mind renewal. It's not heart repair. It's like if you are in Christ, you have a new heart and you are loved by God. You are holy and blameless, and he loves you. He lives in you. You're a temple. So how can your heart not be already there and good and new? And Ezekiel talks about that. Yeah, but it is. It's all about that. Romans 12. It's all about remindering. And it's interesting that we have culturally focused more so on heart repair than we have on mind renewal. And I think that's what's causing this lack of clarity. Hello, welcome again. We're glad to have you here with us. And let's Talk Life. It's our podcast where we talk life. Life in Christ, Christ as life. And just how that looks in ministry and in life and how life is the ministry that Christ in me is living the life and expressing himself through me, through Carl, through you. It's a really beautiful concept, and it's more than a concept. It's more than a doctrine. It's more than a message. It's just. It's life and it's rest. So you can rest and you can be you. It's awesome. [00:01:37] Speaker B: Yeah. Full, abundant, right? [00:01:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. It's beautiful. It's almost like it's the Garden of Eden. [00:01:44] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. It's like when Jesus said, my yoke is easy, my burden is light. If, if. If our burden is heavy, then it's not his burden we're carrying. And we're carrying things he didn't ask us to carry. And it's. I love. I love when we text, you're like, I'm at rest. I'm at rest. And I was just like, oh, that's. I just want to tell you that man affirm you that I love when you say that, because it just is so, so good. So good. [00:02:12] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:02:13] Speaker B: Wow. [00:02:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Thank you. I even just pondering that, like, that doesn't mean my whole day or my whole week was at rest. And it's good to like, to dialogue about that here, because God is the spirit in me, is always going to lead me to the place of rest. I'm not always going to feel like I'm at rest. There's going to be times I feel like I'm on a roller coaster. There's going to be times that I even present myself to anything but God. And it's like all the while I'm okay and I'm loved and because I'm okay because I'm loved, that's eventually where I'll land. And I, I think the, the journey is much shorter or, or like the processing of that is much shorter as you just mature into that understanding. And that's what's been exciting, I think, to really see in my life. That was all affirm you as well. That's what I thought in you from 2019 and forward was, wow. Carl. I've always seen him as pastor, passionate about ministry, doing it. But yeah, there's something different like he's at rest. That doesn't mean that you were always at rest since 2019 either. [00:03:25] Speaker B: No, but it's. [00:03:26] Speaker A: It is amazing. [00:03:28] Speaker B: Yeah, I appreciate you landing on that because it is important for, for all of us to understand. It's not. It doesn't mean we're not going to experience pain or fear or we let our minds go down a certain road where it brings to anxiety or, you know, like, it doesn't. That doesn't mean that everything works, that everything is working out the way I want it to, which is. Which is oftentimes what we want. But it means I'm. I'm at rest right now, Jesus. And who you are inside me, who I am in Christ, I'm at rest in whatever you want for me. That, that your grace is sufficient, that your grace is grace greater that. That he who is in us is greater than he who is in the world. And so I can be at rest. I can be at rest regardless. I love, I just love that Psalm 46. Like the whole world's crumbling around me, but I'm just sitting here, right here in your refuge and your strength. And I'm good. Like I'm clean. I'm close, as one. One of your friends likes to call it. Yeah, yeah, I'm at rest. I'm at rest. [00:04:27] Speaker A: Right. Yeah, it's a great place to be. And it's. It's God's intention for us, his purpose for us. [00:04:34] Speaker B: Right. [00:04:35] Speaker A: Be at rest. Know this. I'm journeying with a guy trying to write some stuff and we're. We're titling what we're writing. Do you not know? [00:04:46] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:04:46] Speaker A: That's Paul's words to so many of the people that he wrote to. Because it's not just in one of his books, it's in multiple. Do you not know? And just like the English language and so much of this, it's like, well, that's a weird question to ask. And it's not really so much a question as much as it's a statement of, hey, listen, like, you already know this stuff. This is. This is already a reality that you have come to terms with. And he's just encouraging them to. He's reminding them of who they truly are. And that's. That's really the edification of one believer to the other. That's how we build each other up, is not by shame on you, you should do better. That doesn't build anybody up. [00:05:34] Speaker B: Right. [00:05:35] Speaker A: What builds them up is saying, hey, you're okay. This is who you are. You might have done that. You might have presented yourself to the. But that's not who you are. And boy, that reminder is so much more encouraging. [00:05:46] Speaker B: Wow. [00:05:46] Speaker A: Because it's not condemning. And it brings me back to the truth. [00:05:50] Speaker B: Wow. [00:05:50] Speaker A: So it's quite amazing stuff. So we're. We're talking. Actually titled our notes for today. Clarity. I don't know if that's a good title if you have a better one. Car. Maybe we should be. Maybe we should just call it Rest. Yeah. [00:06:04] Speaker B: No, I mean, why can't I see clearly, right? What is Jesus? What do you want me to see here? I think that is such a great word. Such a great word. [00:06:15] Speaker A: Well, I mean, I've shared this many times to come into my office and saying, I don't know what I'm doing, and it never has ever taken very long. Just forgot to bring me to a place of reminding me. Yeah, you're okay. [00:06:30] Speaker B: You're. [00:06:30] Speaker A: You're doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing. And the same thing in. In this clarity around. Because I did. I found myself. I found myself saying in this last week, at some point, I don't even. I can't even pinpoint today, and it doesn't matter. But at some point saying, why don't I have clarity? Like, almost out of frustration, why don't I have clarity in the direction that I'm going here or there in this or that? And right away it was just like me coming to my office, it was like, right away God brought me to like, well, that's not really the question. There's a better question to be asked. And the better question is, well, what is clarity? And immediately that brought me not to like answering that question so much as I already have clarity. I have everything that I need. I don't necessarily have every clear everything cleared in my head that. [00:07:19] Speaker B: That I want to know Right, right. [00:07:23] Speaker A: But I'm okay. [00:07:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:07:25] Speaker A: And that's where answering that question, what is clarity? That's where it brought me right away was to that place of rest. Again as we started off talking. [00:07:34] Speaker B: Well, go back to the first verse that you were really, that really led you on this path. You know, it was give me eyes to see. You know, give me eyes to see. Why? Because this is unclear that I, that I, that I can't see you. I, I can't see what's going on around me. I, and I appreciate what you're saying is that we can fall into that where it's like, well, wait a minute, what is this like all the time? Confusion, the enemy, our minds start believing lies. And it's. I think clarity comes from so many ways, but man, that's. I think it's a beautiful word. Beautiful. [00:08:11] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, it's a spirit led life. It's. It's clarity. It's like. And I'm, I'm not of this world, I'm of the Spirit, I'm a new creation in Christ. So that's, that's who I am. And it's wild that we've really, we've just over complicated it in so many ways. [00:08:32] Speaker B: Right. [00:08:32] Speaker A: And that was a whole, whole nother conversation. Probably. That was, that was where I was going to go and I, I don't know, maybe I was going to ponder that verse, but just the power of simplicity. I think that the gospel altogether is very simple and I think that we've really overcomplicated it and made it so difficult and we've done that, we've experienced that, you know, just, just in our journey. [00:08:56] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:08:57] Speaker A: Just just leading others, being in full time church work and our journeys right now within the churches that we minister to, there's, there's all kinds of complicating aspects to all of it. And it's like, boy, if we could. And what we're trying always to do is just, just remind, hey church, this is actually who you are. How about we just rest in this? [00:09:18] Speaker B: And you know, you know, I'm a big, I'm a big feelings wheel guy. Yeah. Because I think it, I think that having words that, that we can use to describe what's going on inside us is very helpful. And what you're kind of referring to as well is life is made up of so many things, so many relationships with work, at work, with friends, family, with, in the body of Christ. And so, so there's so many relationships, there's so many things about life that could be frustrating or uplifting or encouraging or disheartened at the same time. And so, so saying, God, give me some clarity. Right? God, let me, let me have some clarity with this or with this relationship or with this situation or this circumstance. God, God, can I just, can you please show me it from your perspective? Can, can you just give me the eyes to see you that you're in this, that we don't believe a lie is not working. So yeah, that's why I think clarity is, is such a helpful. Like that lens, that grace lens that going back to the. I think the first couple months that we were, you know, podcast together. Right. You know that that lens is, is very helpful. So I know you have for sure in the notes that you wanted to. [00:10:33] Speaker A: Yeah. Where. Where to go? I don't know. I do have stuff in my notes, but I was just pondering even off of what you're saying and I was bringing this up and coming to a podcast near you. We'll probably be talking about this a little bit. We'll see. Maybe Carl will get the book too. [00:10:52] Speaker B: Yeah, I gotta read it. [00:10:54] Speaker A: I just. So this is Watchman Knee. But the title of the book, and I've. I've heard so many people use this phrase, the title of the book, the Normal Christian Life. And I just, I really love that I'm learning to process that and understand why people are using that kind of in these circles because what is normal for what we thought was normal was not truly the normal Christian life. That's not as it was intended to be. But if I'm really walking in the spirit and I am knowing who I am and I'm living out of just receiving that love and trusting God and living that palms up lifestyle, that becomes normal. That just becomes this is who I am. And I think that really brings, it really brings that clarity in our life. So it's just amazing. I don't know. I don't know if I worded that good enough or explained that, but there's, there's so much that just intersects that is so amazing of all the things that I'm like looking at and reading, but. [00:11:57] Speaker B: Right. [00:11:58] Speaker A: I'm looking forward to digging into some of those things out of that book because they have, they were really helpful to me early on. I read that book early on and it was like this is one of the ones I just mentioned off camera. This is one of the books that I would bring to the playground. It was a small book so I could throw it in the bag with the boys stuff. And I would go to the playground with them and I would just chew on. And, and it's kind of so in depth, just so, just deeper thinking is really maybe the best way to put it. And so like I could read a paragraph and I could just ponder that for almost the whole rest of the day. It's like, oh, I can't go, I can't move forward. I just got to think about this. And that's where I would go back to Ephesians 1, say, go open my eyes, enlighten my, my mind to, to what I'm reading. Show me, you know, and, and he has all on the way. But, but man, clarity, clarity, clarity is, is peace. It's rest. [00:12:53] Speaker B: It's rest. I like, I like that question. Why don't I have clarity? And yeah, it's a great question. It's a great, I mean, I mean what a great question. And so if I don't have clarity, it doesn't mean, it doesn't mean that I'm sinning. It doesn't mean, it also doesn't mean that God hasn't shown me either like, or he's not. So, so sometimes we can put like pressure, conjure up some type of pressure of receiving some revelation from God and so we gotta, we gotta do something and then God will do his part. And, and I think sometimes clarity comes through time. I think there, there can be ways that clarity comes to another brother or another sister. [00:13:34] Speaker A: Right. [00:13:36] Speaker B: I think clarity comes when we're curious and open with a spirit as opposed to a prideful heart that's closed off from whatever, from the Lord trying to. I don't know what you think about that, why we don't have it or what. [00:13:54] Speaker A: I love those words. You just use curious and open. I'm trying to do a little write up of like tidbits of my story, but I'm, I'm titling it. Ask God. And, and the reason why is because I think I spent so much of my life not asking like, afraid to ask questions, something I wouldn't ask God, but oftentimes with asking the wrong, with the wrong motive or asking the wrong questions. Yeah, asking questions that were already answered, you know? You know, but yeah, there's, there's so much that I was, I was in pursuit always of the thing that I already had. And so it was like so close and easy because I already it, but yet I was in pursuit of it. And I think that's, that unfortunately is where most believers are at. And so they don't have clarity. But I love you said curious and open. I mean, I think asking questions, like, if I go down and talk to. There are a couple of pastors not too far from me right here, church wise. Like, there's a couple of churches that meet in the same complex. And there's another connection. All three of these pastors have been fired through the years and I know two of them that I've actually sat with and talked to have said, yeah, I, I was fired from one place because I just asked too many questions. It's like, that's, that's interesting. Like, isn't that how you grow and learn and, and shouldn't, shouldn't we be asking those questions? [00:15:17] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:18] Speaker A: To, to know, like from God and from, from mentors. If, if you're not allowed to ask questions, then you're probably in a very controlling environment and they eventually got fired because somebody was in control and you asking too many questions caused. [00:15:33] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:34] Speaker A: Some questions of you. You're getting too close or whatever. [00:15:38] Speaker B: Right. [00:15:38] Speaker A: Their situations are so different. [00:15:40] Speaker B: But yeah, that's a good, it's a good word. So, so I could, I could not have clarity because I'm trying to control, I'm trying to control the situation. I'm trying to control the circumstance. I'm trying to control another person. And so there's no clarity because I'm doing something God didn't ask me to do, which is manage people or control people. Yeah. [00:15:59] Speaker A: While trying to fix people. [00:16:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. [00:16:03] Speaker A: So. Because I think clarity for the Christian, clarity in the Christian life is all about seeing Jesus for who he is and seeing me as a new creation, as who I already am and truly am. That's. That's the clarity. [00:16:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:22] Speaker A: And if, if that's clouded all the time, if I think that I'm a sinful person, but I'm also a saint and I'm always going to be battling those two. And I'm thinking that I have two natures when I can finally come to terms with, okay, no, Jesus gave me new life and I can rest in him, that changes everything. So if I can rest in who I am, you know, Second Corinthians, 5, 17, Colossians 3, I think goes towards, there's no more striving to be close to God. It's actually this rest and realizing I am close. [00:16:54] Speaker B: Wow. [00:16:55] Speaker A: And let me just step into that for a moment. Let me just believe that. And it's amazing what God can do with that because. [00:17:04] Speaker B: Right. [00:17:04] Speaker A: I think it changes everything. Yeah. So I don't, I don't know what you Think about that. [00:17:10] Speaker B: But I said this earlier today to a pastor friend. I said, yeah, pastors, we try to fix. Jesus heals. And so it's just that idea that we try to fix, but it's actually Jesus who heals. So relationships aren't to be fixed. People want to be fixed. Jesus is his desires to bring healing, you know, and sometimes that involves pain. So good, so much pain, hurt, frustration, you know, these pastors you, you know, you're bringing up, you know, to be fired, to be said, you know, I don't believe in you or someone else. No pastor friend of mine that was told, hey, you're just going to be here for a few years until we get someone younger who can do great things, like just the hurtful things that, that, that ministry leaders or pastors can hear that. That we can be shaken to our core. If my in Christ, if my foundation's not in Christ. [00:18:02] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:18:03] Speaker B: And even when my foundation is Christ, I can just be persuaded or I can believe a lie that what they said was true about me or what they said was, you know. [00:18:13] Speaker A: Right. [00:18:13] Speaker B: And what Jesus says about me and say, no, no, no. I need clarity here. I need clarity right here. No fog. You know, we're going to be clear. [00:18:22] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. I mean, I love that. I think. I mean, I love what you're saying. I have a. In my notes here, growth is mind renewal, not heart repair. [00:18:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:33] Speaker A: It goes along with what you're saying. [00:18:35] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:18:35] Speaker A: Growth, not necessarily a word that I love or use all the time, but I would say maturity. [00:18:41] Speaker B: Maturity, yes, yes. [00:18:43] Speaker A: Is mind renewal. It's not heart repair. It's like if you are in Christ, you have a new heart and you are loved by God, you are holy and blameless, and he loves you. He lives in you. You're a temple. So how can your heart not be already there and good and new? And Ezekiel talks about that. [00:19:04] Speaker B: Yeah, but it is. [00:19:05] Speaker A: It's all about that. Romans 12. It's all about mind renewal. And it's interesting that we have culturally focused more so on heart repair than we have on mind renewal. And I think that's what's causing this lack of clarity. Because if I need to fix my heart, I'm never going to be able to do it. If I. If I have to fix everything in my life or if I had to fix everything in everyone else's life. [00:19:30] Speaker B: Boy, it's pretty exhausting, isn't it? [00:19:32] Speaker A: It's exhausting. [00:19:33] Speaker B: Not rest. [00:19:34] Speaker A: That's a good word for it. Yeah. It's the very opposite of rest. Yeah, it's so true. [00:19:39] Speaker B: Yeah. So we can. We can live wild at heart. We can live this. This living out this new heart, this. This new creation that he said that we are. [00:19:50] Speaker A: Right. Wow. Yeah. So good. I mean, I've heard it so many times. I mean, all throughout, you know, leading a youth ministry and stuff. It's like, how many times did I hear it and how many times did I even maybe preach it, but also say it? You hear it from students all the time. And it was sometimes the cry in my heart like, boy, God, I need to spend more time praying, or I need to get rid of. You'd hear this often from students, too. Yeah. I need to get rid of this worldly music, and I need to replace it with Christian music, or I need to get rid of these worldly friends. I need to replace them with Christian friends. It's not like along the way, some of those things are not true. [00:20:23] Speaker B: Right. [00:20:23] Speaker A: But the reality is. [00:20:25] Speaker B: Right. [00:20:26] Speaker A: There's this conviction inside of, oh, I need to pray more. It's a striving that we're. We're focusing on to get closer to God, to shape up our life so that we can be holy instead of actually resting in. I am holy. And the more that I rest in that, the more that actually it's like, well, my friends are doing things that I really don't want to be doing. And so I'm just going to take a step back. It's not because I was challenged by my youth pastor to stay away from those friends. It was because I'm actually seeing and I'm maturing. [00:20:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:56] Speaker A: In my own thinking, because my mind is being renewed into this truth that is already a reality for me. And, man, it's all things that we already have. So I don't know. It's like modern Christianity. The mindset that I always had before, it was almost like 6am at the gym, you know, like, I don't feel like getting up, and I certainly don't feel like going to lifting weights or running on a treadmill. But that's exactly what the Christian life for me was. It felt like it was just this endless trend bill that we're just running on. And it feels really good because going and going off for a good run, it's a sacrifice. It's hard work, but it feels good. And so I'm gonna do it. But the reality is there's no life in that. And that's the wheel of. Or the treadmill of striving is where it's going to leave us so. Man, I don't know. [00:21:43] Speaker B: Yeah. And. And perhaps even as my closing thoughts, it's a overflow or a. A fruit of trust that. That it's. It's a gift to be able to see things different. It's like a spiritual realm, you know that it's like. It's kind of like, all right, Jesus. I. I just want to see it your way. I'm trusting that you're at work. I'm not going to leave the light or not. And. Yeah. So, yeah, oftentimes that's my prayer. God, give me clarity. Father, I'm not seeing it. I'm not seeing you, but I know you're here. I know you're in it. I know you know. [00:22:20] Speaker A: Amen. Amen. Will we receive and will we believe and justice reality? [00:22:26] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:26] Speaker A: It's really where it's all at. Amen. Thank you. It's good to journey and talk life together always. So we're over and out with our episode, talking about clarity.