Ep. 66 - Living The Christ Life

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello, friends, fellow travelers on this journey of knowing and receiving Christ as life. Carl and I, Zach here on our podcast, let's Talk Life. And we get to ponder together every week just that what life looks like. Living the Christ Life. That's our title and our topic today. And many believers, they want to know. They want to know. They want to be fed, they want to be told. This is how you live the Christian life. And we have some good news. The gospel. It is the gospel. It's not about us living it out. It's really about knowing and believing and trusting in the one in us who can live it out. And so, Carl, tell me, I'm desperate. How do I live the Christian life? [00:00:45] Speaker B: Yes. Wow. I love it, you know, when I just think about what the old ways, right? The old, the old, the old wells we drank from. It'd be like, well, read the Bible every day and get to church and start praying and just a list of things. And, and I just love, you know, we're, we're. We. We love similar authors and similar books. And one of the in, you know, in True Faces is knitted the Cure and Bose Cafe and High Trust Leadership course, which is what you and I went through. And I loved what Bill Thrall says. He says disciplines are really. We don't like that word. We like the word express expression. So if I read the Bible and I, it's, it's. I, I want something fresh from God today. I want something fresh from the Father today. And if I'm reading Bill th says this, if I'm reading the Bible for something other than that, I shouldn't be reading it. Like God, what do you have for me today? Not obligation, duty, or chore. [00:01:47] Speaker A: Right. [00:01:48] Speaker B: But from the new heart, connecting with the Father. Same with prayer. I mean, same with, same with whatever it is, it's, it's from. And I know you'll talk about that later, too, just from instead of for. So, just a lot of expressions of who I am. And so if you said, hey, what. What should I do? There's a list of things I could give you, right? [00:02:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:02:10] Speaker B: And, and that's the thing about. So here's, so here's. I'm going to. And then we'll turn it back to you. So if it's a list of things to do, I'm sitting there going, where's the life? Like, like I could maybe do it for a couple of weeks. That's why you go to go to a men's retreat or there's a, There was a Big men's retreat here in Lynchburg. I did not go. But 4,500 guys, and they're all on fire. Well, how long does that last? Right, Right. How long does that last before it's, well, what next? Or why isn't this life? Or, yes, I'm still missing something. And so. So we're not. One more thing. We're not equipping people to trust the Father. We're not equipping people to walk by the spirit. We're equipping people to be dependent on me, the spiritual leader. So come back next Sunday and I'll tell you what to do next. [00:03:00] Speaker A: 100. [00:03:01] Speaker B: All right, man, I'd love to hear your thoughts. How can I be a good Christian? How can I live this life? Zach, what would you say? [00:03:08] Speaker A: Well, you need to pray and read your Bible every day. No, it is. It's exactly that. In fact, I love. I mean, everything that you said, it is all about equipping. And we really have failed to equip people. And there is a fear to equipping, because if I equip you to be. And allow Christ to just be who he is in you and you to know who you are in him, and then you're free to not even have to come to church anymore, or maybe it's going to lead you to another ministry yourself. And so there's. There is that need inside of us to think, no, I can't. I can't. I can't say that I can't equip you too much because then I'll lose you. And I think that that is probably the greatest mistaken notion, because I. That's what ministry really is. Equip and send, equip and send. It's just like when you raise kids. Yeah. It would be great to have your kids close by all the time, all the rest of your life. But the reality is you're equipping them, and by the time they're 18, you're. You're hoping. And you. It's. It's frightening. But you're equipping them to be able to go and live on their own and take care of themselves. You're not equipping them to stay in your basement forever. Right. Especially not here in Florida, because we don't have basements. [00:04:22] Speaker B: So. So fear is a major contributor to church leadership. Yeah. Like, everything's about fear. Are they going to come? Are they not going to stay? Are they going to leave? Are they going to cause problems? So much of, quote, church leadership is on fear. So much of parenting is on fear. So much of. [00:04:41] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:04:42] Speaker B: Afraid of a kid if we don't do this. And the kid might do this. And so from the youngest of ages, we don't teach our kids how to trust their new heart in Christ. We don't teach, we don't show, we don't model. Because we don't know. Because we don't know. And we're not living that way. Right? [00:04:56] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's so true. It's a. It's a sad state of affairs because it is the reality of that, that is. That's ultimately just. You said it. You get to a point where you. You're doing all this stuff, but then you find yourself saying, where's the life? It's exactly where I was at. [00:05:12] Speaker B: That's where you were. [00:05:14] Speaker A: Dynamite. Exciting stuff. Things were happening around me. It's like, why. Why do I feel dissatisfied with what's happening around me, what I'm involved in? Because it's all exciting, but there was no life in it. There was life in the. In the aspect of. Just like what you said. I go on a retreat, I get fired up. I go on a mission trip, I get fired up. But then it dwindles. Why does it dwindle? Where. Where did this go? And so the reality is that that is the truth. You went to a retreat and you were told this is what you to do. This is how you live the Christian life. But you weren't really equipped to know who you are. And so you're not leaving that retreat or whatever it might be or Promise Keepers back in the day was huge. It's like, well, I can make all kinds of promises, but it's not my promises that hold me. It is really God swearing by his own name, by his own self, that it's his promise with himself and he lives in me. That's the promise. That's the rest. That's where I can, as a believer, just. I'm trusting that reality and I can live from there. And so. Man. [00:06:20] Speaker B: So. So, Zach, for 20 years of. You always use the word church work. So we'll just use your terms. 20 years of church work, promises, covenant and commitment. Those are always our terms for people with the church building and, and, and, and it's so crazy when you go back. So actually, yeah, it's God's covenant with himself. God's one that's committed to us. So we talk about commitment. It's actually his commitment to us and his promise to us, not our promise or vow or commitment to God. Isn't that crazy? [00:06:54] Speaker A: Yeah, it's so good. It's so good. And it's so missed. The best part of the gospel, the best part is missed in most circles, and that's just a reality. And so when. When you come to that revel, and it does bring you to a point of like, wow, I have my eyes so open to such incredible life, and I'm so excited. And I had a guy, he came back to me a year later. He's a snowbird, so he's not here all the time. And he came back, he reached out to me, said, I want to get in touch with you and meet up with you. I counseled him before I'm counseling him again. And he came a couple weeks ago, and he said, I went to church yesterday and I was. The challenge was, how devoted are you? And he said, I just. You gave me the cure. You've walked me through some of these principles. I was just sitting in service and I just said, I do not resonate with this. This does not connect with me. It is not about my devotion to God that keeps me. It is. It is God who does all of. Is all Jesus. It is all about me expressing. So it is. I love. This is what Frank Friedman told me. He said, go and be the Zach, Erasmus and expression of Jesus to those people. [00:08:14] Speaker B: Right? [00:08:15] Speaker A: So there's still me, but it's all Jesus, still me. But then the newness in me is all Jesus. And so I was so excited just to have a guy that journeyed, you know, through some stuff and he was able to go to church and actually see this. This isn't. This isn't me. This isn't for me. What you're saying, what you're challenging me with is not for me. And it's not to just criticize that church and that pastor. But he's just like, he doesn't. [00:08:43] Speaker B: Right. I was that way. I mean, you were that way. We didn't know 100. So it was. It was rallying the troops. I mean, that's kind of a terminology. We're rallying the Christians, the believers, the saints. We wouldn't call them that. Right. We're sinners, saved by grace. We're rallying them to be more devoted this week than last week, right? Where it's kind of like, we take. We've said this before. We take the world and we bring it into the kingdom. So. So what I see with sports, in the sports world of training and discipline and working harder, we take that into the kingdom, right? Because we want to build the church, we gotta. We gotta make God proud of us and we gotta earn his love or prove his worth and prove that we're worthy of his love and all these things. And I just love what you said. It's like, wait a minute. What if on Resurrection Sunday or whatever we want to call it, what if we stood up front and said, God's the one devoted to you? What if we said God's committed to you? What if he said, it's not about how faithful you are, it's how faithful he is? Man, Those churches won't grow. [00:09:45] Speaker A: They're not. Yeah, they're not going to grow. But the reality, the people that do receive, that their shoulders have so much less weight. [00:09:52] Speaker B: Yes. When I use the word grow. Yeah. You knew what I meant. Numerical exposition. But all of a sudden, there's relief. [00:10:00] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:10:00] Speaker B: There's a peace and a joy that comes from within. [00:10:05] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. Yeah. If people will receive. [00:10:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Well, that's. Yeah. [00:10:11] Speaker A: I think that's the hardest part of this whole journey. [00:10:13] Speaker B: You're right. You're right. [00:10:14] Speaker A: Is that receiving is so difficult, you know? [00:10:17] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:17] Speaker A: And so we can casually say, yes, God sent Jesus to die on the cross for our sins. And we can, you know, but we. It's real difficult for us to say that we're a new creation, that I've been crucified with Christ, that I am a new man, that the old man is dead. It's hard for us to process that. That was on a video call. It's a book study that we go through, and we're going through Frank's books done by Grace. [00:10:41] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:43] Speaker A: There's all kinds of questions that come up with just even. Just about all these things that we've been taught and we had to rethink. So I want to pull one of the phrases from this book, even. [00:10:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:53] Speaker A: Frank says without Jesus, we may be able to do a lot of things, but none of it will have eternal value. And maybe none of it is a pretty firm and outrageous way of saying it. Because what's amazing is even in the midst of my flesh, which is just me doing it in my own effort. [00:11:15] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:11:16] Speaker A: There is some value to it. But I totally resonate with what he's saying in reality, because that's even what I've really recognized about my ministry now, is I'm able to sit with somebody and be far more effective with them in equipping them with the gospel than ever before. [00:11:34] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:11:35] Speaker A: Because I'm not telling them what to do. I'm showing them who's in them? [00:11:40] Speaker B: Yeah, do it. That's so good. It's like, how do I live the Christian life? What people want is. They want to be told what to do because, because it seems to be something simpler. And, you know, I've shared this story, not, maybe not on camera, but, you know, big, wild at heart guy and, and part of a, a big group that just. Life has taken me away from this group and, and that's okay, but. But I share my story up in, up in Pennsylvania Back in 20, I guess 20, 22, you know, hundreds of guys there. And a guy came up to me after and said, you know what? I committed adultery on my wife 18 years ago. What should I do? And I looked at him and I said, what is God telling you to do? And he said, nobody's ever told me that. I said, well, maybe they should. You know, just saying, what is God calling you? Not what do I think? Or the pastor over there. What is God calling you to do? And so we actually don't believe that there's a Holy Spirit inside me who leads me and guides me and, you know, teaches me and brings me all truth and that he's doing this and that I can actually rely on him. I can actually walk by him, like, because we don't know what he's like. It's something that we experience. It's not something that, yes, you can tell. I mean, you can tell someone, but until their eyes are open, like you said, illumination, revelation. But this is, this is what we're talking about. I mean, everything we're talking about in the last couple years, this is. It is Jesus in me? That's life. [00:13:04] Speaker A: Yep, 100%. And, and it, and it applies to every part of our daily lives. [00:13:11] Speaker B: Yes. [00:13:11] Speaker A: That was even my experience just this morning. You know, you know, struggles, people going through difficulties, trying to decide what's the next step. And that's oftentimes where it's like, what am I supposed to do as a Christian with this? What's my next step? And so you have maybe jobs, moving, minist, ministry, kids. [00:13:33] Speaker B: Yes. [00:13:34] Speaker A: Spouse, you know, all kinds of decisions that come along with all those things. And God. I had 20 minutes of driving. I got the text. Yeah, guys struggling to know what's next. And I just, I didn't respond right away. I just drove for 20 minutes and just processed with God, like, yeah, that's real. This is really heavy stuff. [00:13:54] Speaker B: Right. [00:13:55] Speaker A: And it's really difficult to go through that heavy stuff. And I don't have all the answers. And I don't need to have all the answers. And so it was just me of just taking that step rather than trying to answer right away and be an encouragement and be the guy that can give him all the answers. I took a whole different approach to. I'm not going to respond right now. I'm just going to trust you. God, what do you have? And it was so beautiful because you're faced with a decision that's in front of you and that's what he's asking. I don't know what to do with this decision that's in front of me. And so I just said, well, in that decision, are you approaching it from or for? And I could say that to him because we've journeyed together for a long time and. And so when I got here this morning, that's where how I began. Was just starting to text him some stuff and. But like in our spiritual understanding. Yeah. Am I living for God? No, that's not, that's not right. I'm living from my, my new heart and who I already am and then in our daily lives. So I' this as an example because I moved myself, my family, we moved from Michigan down here to Florida. And how did I know that that was the right thing to do? [00:15:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Right. [00:15:10] Speaker A: You know what the answer is? I didn't know. I didn't know. And. But what I did know is I was operating from who I am in Christ. [00:15:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:23] Speaker A: I wasn't trying to prove anything. Wasn't trying to. It was just I was living out of my true identity. So I was living from. I wasn't living for. I wasn't trying to do it to make a point or just make a statement or do. I was just like, this is the next step that, that we're going to take because in my spirit, this is where I feel at, at peace and at rest. And it's so amazing that. Yeah. Even we're faced with some weighty things because we moved down here with. [00:15:51] Speaker B: Right. [00:15:51] Speaker A: Nothing. [00:15:52] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:52] Speaker A: No future. Ina had a job. My wife, she had a job up in Michigan. Still for six more weeks after that it was like, I don't know. [00:16:01] Speaker B: Right. [00:16:01] Speaker A: I don't know what it's going to look like. Ministry wise. I have no connections down here. I don't know what it's going to look like. By all logic, none of that made sense. But I was living from a place of I know who I am and I can trust the one who's in me. And so this is a even I just sent I'll share The prayer that I even sent to him, I just said. I wrote it as I was texting, like, this is how I am praying for you, and you can personalize this prayer for yourself. And so I gave him the personalized prayer version and said, God, I'm looking for the next step, a new position, yet it's you in me that I'm trusting in my search. I choose to believe and to trust you over my efforts. [00:16:45] Speaker B: Yes. [00:16:45] Speaker A: And I rest in moving at your pace. [00:16:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:49] Speaker A: You are my provider, and I'm trusting you to provide for my family and the situation in front of me. And it's like, where did that come from? It came from me just resting in and not responding right away, too, and just resting in. Okay, who am I? And it's like he wrote. He wrote back. Like, wow. Yeah. It's just so profound. I said, well, you know, when I'm able to look from the outside in, it's easy for me. I said, put me in the heat of the moment. [00:17:15] Speaker B: Yes. Well, that's right. [00:17:18] Speaker A: Holding her story. Right. [00:17:19] Speaker B: Well, the importance of the body of Christ. Right. The importance of a brother I can trust, I can talk to. Yeah. And even you didn't ask this question, but I connected it to it before we got on air. Here. We all wonder, what's God's will? What's God's will? Like you said, when you move from Michigan to Florida, how did you know was the right thing? You didn't. Right. You were just saying, all right, Jesus, you're in me. So wherever I go, there's union. [00:17:46] Speaker A: Right. [00:17:46] Speaker B: I mean, think about that. Wherever I go, we're always taught separation. So somehow you can be out of God's will by moving to Florida instead of staying in Michigan, or by doing this instead of this. And. And I look back and just say, no, no, God, you're. You're so good that if this is where you want me, like, if. Like, if you didn't want me in Appomattox, Virginia, you'll move me. And that's part of the rest of the gospel. We can actually rest in the gospel. And he even brings it up. He's like, hey, guess what? You know, if God doesn't want you there, he'll send a hurricane a month after you were there. Oh, wait a minute. He did. [00:18:20] Speaker A: He did that. [00:18:22] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. But. But just the point of man, it's a different perspective on God's will or which way. And it's just like, all right, God, whatever you have. Right, Right. I want to be open to it. I don't want to. I don't want to kick against the ghost. I don't. You know that you're in me, right? And so that there's this something more beautiful than the separation of what we thought. Like, well, if I get to church and I'm praying, well, what happens? I'm living that way, right? I'm going to church, I'm praying, I'm reading the Bible. And then bad things happen to my family or bad things happen to me. Marriage dissolved or relationships gone, or job sickness. Then all of a sudden, God didn't hold up his bargain, right? Then I'm looking at God as, like, why? And it just is a spiral, as opposed to union idea, union, thought of Christ in my life, whatever I do, wherever I go, we're together. It's Christ in me. And then it becomes exciting. Then there's joy, despite pain, despite sorrow. Like you said, this is heavy stuff, Jesus, Do I trust that I'm more valuable to you than a bird? Because you promised, right? Jesus promised that your Father in heaven loves you. [00:19:35] Speaker A: So beautiful. [00:19:36] Speaker B: Even better than the lose of the field or the. Do I really believe it? Do I really trust it? Most of my life I did, because it was all about manipulation, control, and trying to figure it out. [00:19:46] Speaker A: Me too. Yeah. And that produces a lot of anxiety, weight on your shoulders, pressure, because you think it all. Because you think it all depends on you. So once you step into this reality of, no, it's not me that does any of this stuff, right? So how do you. How do you live the Christian life? I like how Frank puts it. He, like, he says the Christian life is oftentimes the term he says. I don't like using that phrase. He just calls it the Christ life. Yeah, I like that because it's Christ in me. It's just the Christ life. And so even we titled this living the Christ life. Well, what does that actually look like? Well, it's not really me living any particular way or doing anything specific or if there is anything specific. It's me living just as Jesus did, in dependence on the Father. He depended on the Father, and we are to live exactly the same way. The biggest issue that we have is not sin. It's actually independence. You know, we want to live independently of God. [00:20:45] Speaker B: So it's. [00:20:45] Speaker A: Yeah. Coming to that realization, we can experience Christ's life always. I loved it. I love this verse. I'll kind of just close with this verse because First John 5:12 says, he who has the son has the life man. And it's abundant life. It's a joy filled life. It is the fruit of the spirit life. And look at all. What believer doesn't want to have all that? Love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control. We all, we're all striving for something that in reality, we already have it. [00:21:19] Speaker B: It's all yours. It's. [00:21:21] Speaker A: It's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. So, man, it's an exciting. It's an exciting journey. So thanks for tuning in to let's Talk Life.