Ep. 75 Called To or Called Into?

[00:00:00] Speaker A: Ultimately what it is, we've been so equipped to be sin conscious and not to be Christ conscious. [00:00:07] Speaker B: Yeah, that. [00:00:08] Speaker A: That's the way that we live our life. So if you're sin conscious, then you're gonna be only thinking about sin and you're gonna continue to sin because you're gonna view yourself as a sinner. And so like this, this verse and the reality of it being so identity heavy. That's the best way maybe to say it. I don't know. Yeah, it's really depicting this is my identity. Rest in this truth of this is who you are. And so for me, the biggest hindrance was always, well, but I still sin. Hello. Welcome, brothers and sisters. Thanks for tuning in. We'd love to hear from you. You know, we have our emails in the description. Leave a comment. Text us if you know us. Share this with someone. This is our little podcast, Low budget. It's Carl and I just pondering life. Life in Christ. [00:00:57] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:00:58] Speaker A: But we'd love to know how it connects with you. So today, this week, this episode, however it works for you, what does it mean to be called specifically? And this is, I guess my pondering is are we called to or are we called into? I think, Carl, this is maybe something that is like a signature on our let's Talk Life podcast here. But yeah, part of pondering these things is going, okay, how did I used to understand this and how do I understand this now? [00:01:25] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:01:27] Speaker A: And that's not a bad place, I guess, to. To maybe begin or. I don't know what you think, Carl. [00:01:31] Speaker B: And it's. It's really easy to see where I used to be because there's so many people in it. [00:01:36] Speaker A: That's true. [00:01:37] Speaker B: That it's. That it's like, oh, yeah, that's what I used to think too. And it brings me just a smile. A big phrase in the Southern church world down here is when were you called? And what that phrase is usually meaning is when were you called to be a preacher is really what is sort of the terms and words that use. When. When were you. When were you called to be a preacher? And it was like, that's how I used to talk. That's how I, you know, talk about my calling. Talk about my calling. And something never seemed right about it because. Because I never had this Jesus showing up in my bedroom saying, you know, solitarsis moment. I want you to be a pastor. [00:02:20] Speaker A: Right. [00:02:21] Speaker B: And so it's kind of like you just bluff it because you don't know what to Say so. Yeah, yeah. You know xyz. [00:02:29] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:02:30] Speaker B: And so that's. That's how I used to look at it. Like. Or. Or it was kind of like, I'm. I'm really special and God called me because, man, I'm the mvp. [00:02:40] Speaker A: No, that's so. Man, it's so good. It is something that I've pondered and thought about. What does that do to other people that don't feel called in the same place? We're almost sideswiping people and say that we're better because we're in this position. It's like, no, man. So when we can recognize and see it properly, see it biblically. Oh, man. It changes everything. Like, the guy. The guy that's like, you know, washing windows or. Or, you know, selling cars or is. Is just as much called by God as the pastor that's preaching on Sunday. And so. [00:03:19] Speaker B: Wow. And we might. And we might even. We might even say that up front, but that's not. That's not the whole system, and that's not what we've portrayed. [00:03:28] Speaker A: Wow. So, yeah. Called to or called into. I. I feel like I am called by God. Like, that statement is associated with purpose in life. And the statement isn't necessarily wrong, but the mindset behind it is. So a proper mindset is answering the question that, you know, I'm throwing out there today. Am I called to or am I called into? And all believers are called. That's. That's really where I'm really coming to understand. My story has always been. I was in third grade, I got saved, and then I was called. I felt called to the mission field, and I was going to go to Australia. And it's like, well, why. Why was all that happening? It's because the youth leader in our church was going to go to Australia. [00:04:12] Speaker B: Right. [00:04:12] Speaker A: You know, so. And none of that's bad. I feel like God was stirring in my heart. And so that's. That's, I think, where a lot of this for me is coming from. Because I always struggled to say now, okay, yeah, this is when I believed and received Christ. And then always the next statement that I usually say is, then I also felt called. So just like you. It was. And I didn't know that I was doing it necessarily, but I feel like it actually belittles other people to say, oh, you don't know when you were called and you don't know what you're called to. [00:04:43] Speaker B: Sure. [00:04:43] Speaker A: Or. [00:04:43] Speaker B: Or it's like, oh, were you called to this church? Or the church is, you know, we Use that term as well. Like, I was called to this, to this, this church building, you know, and not, not comfortable with that statement either anymore. [00:04:59] Speaker A: Right. [00:04:59] Speaker B: You know, of, that's, that's kind of like man's perspective. [00:05:03] Speaker A: Sure. [00:05:04] Speaker B: On, on life and, and ministry. [00:05:07] Speaker A: Yep. Oh, that's the confusion all along is that we've tried to, tried to explain everything in our Western culture. We like to have everything explained. [00:05:15] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:05:16] Speaker A: Instead of really trusting and believing by faith. [00:05:20] Speaker B: So when you, when you bring up called to, called into what are, what are some passages or what are some. Where would you like to start when you think about that, those two phrases? [00:05:29] Speaker A: Well, one thing that I was going to say before we even get there. [00:05:32] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:05:33] Speaker A: No, this was just funny. It just came to my mind as we were talking because I mentioned Australia. There was a time, this was maybe a few years ago, it could have been longer, but I remember getting a phone call and on the caller ID it actually said Australia. And I said, oh, God is calling me back to Australia. [00:05:49] Speaker B: Yes, he's calling you back. [00:05:51] Speaker A: I thought that was really funny. But no, I mean, what brought me to this? First of all, I think I've always kind of pondered this and have been kind of like, what does this really mean? Because it bugged me that I used that as the next phrase in my explanation of when I was saved. And I didn't like it, and I didn't understand why I didn't like it. But I was reading, okay, this was like 10 days ago. I began to just like, oh, I'm going to read First Corinthians, and I'm just going to read through these letters and just process stuff just as a casual kind of reading. [00:06:22] Speaker B: Right. [00:06:22] Speaker A: And I only got to verse two of chapter one, and, and I literally, it just stopped me in my tracks. And I haven't gotten any further even since then. [00:06:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:33] Speaker A: If I'm really honest, and some can say, oh, that's, that's laziness or whatever, but I just think I, I, I enjoy this journey with God, that I don't have to accomplish the task that I was even set out to, to do. No, I, I received something from God in verse two, and I was just so excited. And so that's really where it began. So, so let's dig. [00:06:55] Speaker B: I will say this, I will say this because I'm going to forget it. And one of the dangers is if, if I think that somehow there's one specific calling for me and that's not how my life turned out, then I Think I miss God's call. There's so much danger. And. And when we use this word, calling, as if. As if there's this one specific thing that God called you to do and you didn't do it, so now you're going to be like Jonah, swallowed by F. Whatever. And, man, there's a danger when we think I missed my calling. And this happens all throughout our life. Yeah. You know, did I. Did I marry the wrong person? Did I do this wrong? Did I do that wrong? Did I not go to this church? Should I have went to this church? Like, we start playing these what ifs or. [00:07:38] Speaker A: Right. [00:07:38] Speaker B: And I think there's a real great danger when we. When we don't understand what the calling is. And that's maybe that's what I wanted to preface that by saying. [00:07:48] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, no, I think that's beautiful because I think that's. It's not only true, it's also. It's very, very true for so many people. So many people are really struggling with that. And that's why books like Neil Purpose Driven Life exploded, because everybody wants to know their purpose. They want to be driven by something. And, man, what I've come to understand is what drives me more, what compels me more, is really the love of God and receiving his love. And then I'm able to love others, not because I'm trying, because that's the overflow, receiving. So, man, that's truly the beginning point for me. But, yeah, I mean, I love this. How to even process 1 Corinthians 1:2 is the verse. This is what really hit me. [00:08:35] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:08:36] Speaker A: The NIV 1985 is the version that I had since I graduated from school, went to Bible college, with all my years of working as a pastor in a church. So that version and then the version of the Bible that I really use now is the Nai. And there's such a difference in this verse. And this is what just. Just gripped me. So that's kind of where this is coming from because the NIV mentions being called to, and the NASB really is. Is called into. And so I just. [00:09:09] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:09:10] Speaker A: I just was trying to process these things and I came across this verse, like I said, just because I wanted to read through Corinthians. I didn't get very far. But I'm so fascinated by just. Just how God really brought that out. And I think that it's all about identity. I think this verse is very identity heavy. And so that's really the beginning point. So here's what it says in the NASB to the Church of God, which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling with all who in every place call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. So just the middle part of that verse, there's two aspects that are very. [00:09:48] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:48] Speaker A: Very identity heavy statements. Those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus who are saints by calling. And so here you have that word call or calling. [00:09:59] Speaker B: Yes. [00:10:00] Speaker A: In the NIV it says this, sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy. So that's very different than saints by calling. And the difference is exactly what I'm posing as the question, are we called to or are we called into? So I don't know if you have thoughts there, Carl. [00:10:19] Speaker B: No, I like to keep hearing like, as you, as you've been processing this and thinking about what, what are the nuances or what are the differences? What is that? Like, what does that lead us to? [00:10:31] Speaker A: Yeah, well, you already kind of touched on if I in the NIV am only focused on called to be holy. That's something that I'm striving for. [00:10:40] Speaker B: Okay. [00:10:41] Speaker A: I'm going to try and to live a holy life. [00:10:44] Speaker B: Right. [00:10:44] Speaker A: I'm not seeing myself as a saint. That's the NASB says I'm a saint. [00:10:50] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [00:10:51] Speaker A: And I'm not picking up on that from the niv. And that's, you know, that's been my processing all along because I've only used the niv and it's really skewed me wrong. And it's not that. So I don't want to just bash on different versions of the Bible. I want to recognize first of all that God will bring me to an understanding and to a revelation and a knowing and an intimate knowing of himself through any version of the Bible because I asked him and he revealed. [00:11:19] Speaker B: That's right. That's right. And that's right. [00:11:21] Speaker A: And when I was praying that prayer, I was praying it straight out of the niv. It wasn't like I, you know, so. Yeah, so God can use whatever means he needs to get through to us. So it's not about, don't use this Bible, you know, but at the same time there's problems. [00:11:36] Speaker B: Yeah. So King James version says to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints. ESV says to those sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints. [00:11:48] Speaker A: Called to be. [00:11:49] Speaker B: And so they, they. So ESV and King James are very similar with the right. With the, with the sense called to be saints. I think you said NASB says saints by calling and then you said NIV says called to. [00:12:03] Speaker A: Called to be holy. [00:12:05] Speaker B: Gotcha. Yeah. So it's interesting that saints sort of like a noun identity statement. Yeah. Holy is a connotation. And maybe, maybe it's not even an iv. Maybe it's how we've used it. Yeah, but, but it's also called to be holy. That's something that is my responsibility now. [00:12:25] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:25] Speaker B: And so it's. And so, and here's the danger, right? Not Jesus makes me holy. And now I can live it out. It's, well, Jesus saved me, so now I need to, I need to earn holiness. I have to, I have to, I have to somehow attain it. [00:12:44] Speaker A: Yes. [00:12:44] Speaker B: And it's like, oh, that's, that's, that, that's the trap that got us stuck for 40 years. [00:12:50] Speaker A: Absolutely. [00:12:50] Speaker B: And maybe that's as you're reading it, you're seeing that and then maybe, maybe that's part of it too. Right? [00:12:56] Speaker A: For sure. For sure. Because there's always been in my mind there was this command to be holy as I am holy, as the verse says. [00:13:03] Speaker B: Right, right, right. [00:13:05] Speaker A: I never processed that until I journeyed through. Even in class, I remember the phrase, this helped me to actually take even that very verse to understand what that means. And the phrase that I heard often was that God's commands before Christ to become his promises when you're in Christ or after Christ. And that changes everything. So that command actually becomes a promise. It's no longer am I striving towards becoming holy, now I can rest in I am holy and it's a promise. And God is going to uphold his promises because that's who God is. And just that alone changes everything. So from this verse and from the sanctified in Christ and the saints, by calling the sentence, if we summed it up, how I, how I always perceived it, first of all, this is the sentence. You should be striving to become holy. That's how I perceived it. But it's actually, this is who you already are in Christ. This is who you already are. Trust this reality and live from there. And that's, this is a reality that I never saw before. And it's, it's one of the things in, in these last three years for me, five year journey, three years of actually stepping into this revelation. [00:14:19] Speaker B: Right. [00:14:20] Speaker A: When I saw that through throughout class and understand, I was just like, wow, that changes everything for me. It's so, so beautiful. [00:14:27] Speaker B: How so? Maybe a good question for that, because this is really important that. That Jesus is the one who, you know, just. Even the basic word of calling or holy one set apart. [00:14:40] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:14:41] Speaker B: So. So Jesus is the one who sets us apart. He's the one that makes us holy. [00:14:47] Speaker A: Right. [00:14:48] Speaker B: The difference is pretty big. You said it changes everything. What does it look like, maybe, Zach, for you, when you embrace that truth about. About yourself. [00:14:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:14:59] Speaker B: That you are actually whole. You actually are a saint. [00:15:02] Speaker A: Sure. [00:15:03] Speaker B: Right now. Because of Christ, in Christ, into Christ. [00:15:06] Speaker A: Well, it changes, man. I mean, I go back to even just yesterday morning teaching a Bible class before the service, and there's one guy that's just been chewing on all this stuff and trying to process it, but he just, he thinks. And he outright just said, I sin every single day. Even when I'm sleeping, I feel like I'm sinning. And I think. I think, you know, ultimately what it is, we've been so equipped to be sin conscious and not to be Christ conscious. [00:15:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:15:39] Speaker A: That. That's the way that we live our life. So if you're sin conscious, then you're gonna be only thinking about sin and you're gonna continue to sin because you're gonna view yourself as a sinner. And so like this, this verse and the reality of it being so identity heavy. That's the best way maybe to say it. I don't know. Yeah, it's really depicting this is my identity. Rest in this truth of this is who. Who you are. And so for me, it's the same thing. Like I was in the striving to become holy. The biggest hindrance was always, well, but I still sin all the time. I'm such a wicked, evil sinner. [00:16:17] Speaker B: Right, right, right. [00:16:18] Speaker A: And I could only see myself as that. So I couldn't believe this reality that I was a saint. And so that's. That leaves us really only to fight our sin on our own, to fight to become holy as if we could in some way. And it just. It really just doesn't work. This mentality keeps the pressure all on us to perform well. And instead the pressure can be put on God's finished work and he can handle the pressure. We can. [00:16:48] Speaker B: Right. And. And even going back to how you first started this, this talk together today where you said, I was reading First Corinthians and I never made it past verse two, and there was no pressure, condemnation. Yeah. Because you didn't read the whole book and you finished the chapter. You were saying, hey, I'm just going to marinate on this. I'm just going to process this. Like I Mean, listen, brothers and sisters, like, I would rather someone process one verse for 365 days. [00:17:14] Speaker A: Yes. [00:17:15] Speaker B: Than to read the Bible in one year and be like, okay, great. Because transformation is. Is not a sprint, you know, and so marinating on this. And so. So for me, it'. Okay, here's the letter that we would always say. Well, this is the most carnal church and the carnal Christians. And don't be a carnal Christian. And the warnings. And he literally starts it by saying to the church that is in Corinth, it was sanctified. Like, past tense. [00:17:47] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:17:47] Speaker B: Like. Like a done deal, like a finished work. And so. And that. That. That Christ, as he says later, we're sanctified. We're justified. Like, Jesus Christ did it all. Yeah. And so the. The growth is awareness. [00:18:03] Speaker A: Right. [00:18:04] Speaker B: The growth. I mean, think about this. This is such a great truth. Yeah. That there's growth and there's an awareness and there's maturing, but there's no more. Getting closer. [00:18:14] Speaker A: Yep. Yeah. [00:18:15] Speaker B: That's. That's like. That's crazy for me still. [00:18:18] Speaker A: Well, it is that I'm as close [00:18:21] Speaker B: to Jesus right now as I ever will be. Right. Right. [00:18:24] Speaker A: You can't get closer than united. [00:18:26] Speaker B: And. And they think about this. Right. It's union. Is that. It's not because of my commitment to him. [00:18:32] Speaker A: Right. [00:18:32] Speaker B: It's because of his commitment to himself. [00:18:35] Speaker A: Right. [00:18:35] Speaker B: And I'm included in it. [00:18:37] Speaker A: Wow. [00:18:38] Speaker B: By receiving Jesus. [00:18:40] Speaker A: That's so good. [00:18:41] Speaker B: So when you talk about changing everything, man, all this union, being sanctified, you know, set apart saints by calling. Like, that's my new identity. [00:18:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:18:54] Speaker B: And so if I'm Christ conscious, if I'm. If I'm. If I gaze upon Christ, fix your eyes on Christ. Have the mind of Christ. Like, all the verses fluid. Philippians, Colossians, Hebrews 12. [00:19:03] Speaker A: Right. [00:19:03] Speaker B: And it's like. Yeah. The further I am from the sin. Yeah. So. So easily ensnares. This. Are entangled. Sad. Just throw it off. Just throw it off. Right. It's a hindrance. Throw it off. Get rid of it. You don't need it, you know? Hebrews 12. The root of bitterness I can forgive. Yeah. You know what? It's gonna be hurtful and painful. Jesus, you hold my pain. I mean, this is real stuff. [00:19:24] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. It's so good. I just love it, you know? Still. Still here in that first chapter, I mean, you jump to verse four, because Paul here is not trying to say, try harder. [00:19:37] Speaker B: Right. [00:19:38] Speaker A: God graces them. He's telling them thanksgiving comes from what God has given you. And. [00:19:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:19:44] Speaker A: And he's reminding them of what they've been given. And in verses 7 and 8, he. He very clearly says that you're not lacking anything. You have everything. [00:19:52] Speaker B: Right. [00:19:54] Speaker A: And so it's, it's so like there's this security all the way to the end. Like you are, you are good with God. [00:20:00] Speaker B: That's so good. [00:20:01] Speaker A: And then I. This is where I really love. Maybe this is where I got the word called into. Also verse 9 says, God is faithful. You were called into fellowship. [00:20:10] Speaker B: Yeah, that's. That's beautiful. [00:20:12] Speaker A: I really love that. And what we're also called into is that fellowship. And just like what you're saying. Yeah, we're united with him. [00:20:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:20:22] Speaker A: I can believe this because it's actually a reality. And it's not a reality we like to, to grab hold of or that we can grab hold of because we still struggle with maybe something like, but I still have this cinema in my life. And it's like, well, yeah, but you're a saint. You still sin, but you're a saint. And it's like, well, I can't process this. But man, we are not called to. You know, when I have the mentality of being called to something, it really leaves me floundering and frustrated. I think in my Bible college days, I was floundering, frustrated, didn't know the direction that I was supposed to be going. How do I know the call of God? How do I understand this? That's where it left me. But we're called into. If I know that I'm clean, that I'm close, that's fellowship. I can confidently and restfully and very effectively live as a child of the king, because that's exactly who I am. I'm a child of the King. And it's just so, so amazing. [00:21:16] Speaker B: Wow. And I want to just, you know, conclude my portion. [00:21:21] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:21:21] Speaker B: By. By some. By really some, Some helpful things. And that is that identity comes first. [00:21:29] Speaker A: Yes. [00:21:29] Speaker B: Like, like, like everything comes out of my identity. Everything flows from Christ in me, for sure. But if I, but if I didn't get that right, then, then it's going to be like you just said, constant frustration. [00:21:41] Speaker A: Yep. [00:21:42] Speaker B: Because I'm getting it wrong. I keep getting it right. So versus, you know, versus, like, you know, you brought up pre record about from Ephesians about walking worthy, you know, Coloss unworthy. And I just love the cure. We've talked about it many times. True face and so helpful and, and, you know, so what about verses like, oh, well, we have to walk in a manner worthy of the Lord, fully pleasing to him, bearing fruit in every good work and increasing the knowledge of God. And the authors are very helpful. Say when we understand this verse to mean that to walk in a manner worthy is an obligation which God intends us to honor by our effort. And thereby through strenuous effort striving, we become pleasing to God. We become the judge of how much effort pleases God. And we are quick to judge others for not having enough effort. [00:22:30] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:30] Speaker B: And that probably happened yesterday morning all around the U.S. but if we understand. Sorry, Sunday. But if we understand this verse to mean we are able. That you and I are able to walk worthy. [00:22:42] Speaker A: Right. [00:22:42] Speaker B: Because we trust God, who. God says we are saints. First Corinthians 1, 2. [00:22:49] Speaker A: Wow. [00:22:49] Speaker B: Then we are pleasing to him and we are able to bear fruit in every good work. Our effort cannot produce a good fruit. The good fruit comes out of the reality who we are as we abide in Christ. And that's just another topic. [00:23:02] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:03] Speaker B: As well. Remaining in Christ. [00:23:05] Speaker A: Wow. [00:23:06] Speaker B: I think that's very helpful for you and me as well. [00:23:09] Speaker A: Yeah. So good. I mean, there's. There are practical steps to understanding new covenant. Sometimes it's called. I really just. It's the gospel. It's the original gospel of Jesus Christ. And there's clarity that the gospel really brings. And that's exactly what we're talking about. You don't strive to become what you already are in Christ. [00:23:30] Speaker B: Right. [00:23:30] Speaker A: You can live out of your identity as a saint. And Paul, this is. You already touched on this, but it's just good to conclude here, too. [00:23:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:38] Speaker A: Paul addresses these believers at Corinth as saints, even while correcting them. [00:23:44] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:44] Speaker A: So they're not dirty worms. They're beloved family members learning to walk in grace. They are learning to walk in grace. And that's the journey with fellow travelers learning to walk in the love and the grace of God. [00:24:00] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:00] Speaker A: So that's just beautiful. So I think we'll conclude there. I gotta get up, but sweet over now.